tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post2764174505503718267..comments2024-03-27T01:28:28.346-07:00Comments on False Machine: The Eight Worghast Lawspjamesstuarthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13288777018721199748noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-2270155050200389862019-12-08T20:43:25.456-08:002019-12-08T20:43:25.456-08:00I'll also add that I am very impressed by how ...I'll also add that I am very impressed by how enmeshed in the lore the post is, yet it hits on fundamental principles that could apply to a number of other games. For instance, the Thinking Engine of Troika!, or the clockwork golems of Yoon Suin.Ancalagon_TBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13602961033235852856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-58182949154077510192019-12-08T20:40:26.146-08:002019-12-08T20:40:26.146-08:00This post blew my mind. The world building, the d...This post blew my mind. The world building, the depth of thought... bravo! Ancalagon_TBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13602961033235852856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-69634156884355818152019-12-03T10:26:02.385-08:002019-12-03T10:26:02.385-08:00I see what you mean. You did solve the posted prob...I see what you mean. You did solve the posted problems elegantly by making the AI rare as well as incapable of exponential (and self-reliant) growth. I did get a hint of Butlerian Jihad in there too but I couldn't quite place it until you wrote this comment. Love the concept – and your conclusion of people without challenge growing up to be fucket-up is part of the Dune lore, if I remember correctly. The reasons for the Butlerian Jihad weren't just the dangers of AI killing off or replacing mankind, but AI keeping people from reaching their true potential, right?<br /><br />By the way (totally off topic): Dune is one of the very few Sci Fi universes where not just science has advanced but so have the humanities. Where else has psychology learned to make people break with a single word?Martenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12978941864880013486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-91633078347824974952019-12-03T03:24:32.494-08:002019-12-03T03:24:32.494-08:00A main challenge was just finding a way to integra...A main challenge was just finding a way to integrate magic robots into a setting without crashing the coherency of that setting.<br /><br />In 5e, I think in the dominant setting Warforged are still a 1st Gen thing & the factories making them have been shut down (for how long who knows), so working through all the wierd implications is something that players and dms do in play.<br /><br />I didn't want to repeat that, and Uud already has a strange post-science-fiction tinge to a lot of its worldbuilding, so I did what a lot of world-builders do who want sci-fi tech but coherent explicable social situations and basically did a post-butlerian jihad thing where the Singularity already nearly happened but the world pulled back from it just before.<br /><br />So that meshes the diagetic explanation with my problem IRL. In-world people are trying to work out, how do we incorporate this tech without it destroying us or making us evil?" and I'm thinking "How do I have robots in a world and the world still works in a way coherent to players and DMs?"<br /><br />The question of protecting AI from us as much as we need protecting from it is an interesting one. Even a lot of "positive" AI futures involve us essentially creating a race of highly capable happy slaves, who essentially live entirely for us.<br /><br />You could argue that Asimocs solution was a bit like that.<br /><br />There are a few problems, the first one simple and material and the second more subtle.<br /><br />First if humanity grows up with this symbiotic shadow race of happy slaves, even if things go "well" we would still be a species with a huge amount of resources and not much challenge. If you look at individual humans who grow up in those situations, they are fucked up. The absence of meaningful challenge retards charicter formation, making them nasty, narcissistic hysterical and easily lead, and they also have power, which is bad.<br /><br />So thats one negative.<br /><br />The more complex one and the one harder to prove is that making a race of happy, self-aware slaves might simply be wrong on its own terms,regardless of the material effect, that simply doing that would be an evil act. Which I intuitively think is true but its rather hard to prove with logic.pjamesstuarthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13288777018721199748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-35023868508445795772019-12-03T02:12:27.705-08:002019-12-03T02:12:27.705-08:00Apologies, it's lonely out here! Yes I agree w...Apologies, it's lonely out here! Yes I agree with you, and that is made explicit in the post. I think the other major difference for me is that unlike Asimov, Patrick is writing in an era where AI is not a theoretical concept, and the "discourse" (and gods that term is overused) concerning the existential threat posed by AI is becoming increasingly mainstream. That's not to say that this is a "mainstream" piece on robotics, instead it represents what a sophisticated, 21st Century parocosmologist thinks about when they think about AI!Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11685436746460917538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-71496050784774180262019-12-02T22:32:51.158-08:002019-12-02T22:32:51.158-08:00Despite the air of despair you project, I'll t...Despite the air of despair you project, I'll talk to you! I initially actually expected this to be a Stuarty take on Asimov's laws but it isn't. I think the difference is that, while Asimov proposed his laws in order to protect mankind from robotkind, Stuart's laws of robotics work in both ways.Martenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12978941864880013486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-51948511704578112912019-12-02T18:48:28.632-08:002019-12-02T18:48:28.632-08:00The worghast laws remound me of Asimov. Ina good ...The worghast laws remound me of Asimov. Ina good way, if that's not already clear. I guess that's not really a very original observation, but I'm putting it here anyway because I'm hoping someone will talk to me.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11685436746460917538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-4318970764029216242019-12-02T17:32:31.209-08:002019-12-02T17:32:31.209-08:00No free lunch. Favorite saying of libertarian necr...No free lunch. Favorite saying of libertarian necromancer Miltonicus Friedman.Tedankhamenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00181643018957592969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4522018539311056682.post-21297422907893937782019-12-02T15:59:49.689-08:002019-12-02T15:59:49.689-08:00This is great stuff!This is great stuff!Gwythainthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05184355400691527355noreply@blogger.com